Post by pengolod on Sept 20, 2007 23:04:01 GMT -5
Hi. My name is Steve and I’ve also been working on a Silmarillion screenplay for a while now. I think I may have started about the same time as you guys, but I didn’t find this site back at that time. I was looking around to see what anyone had to say about the subject, and I found various posts on various blogs, plus I found the “Translations from the Elvish” project (a group trying to make a coherent and more detailed account of Tolkien’s Legendarium, no film), but not this site.
I will share here my opinions about what I’ve seen on this site and explain some of what I’m doing.
My first comment is about what material to cover. I personally do not trust anyone other than J.R.R. Tolkien himself to write compellingly about Middle-earth. I think a large part of the enjoyability of The Silmarillion is in how it is presented by the author, and for that reason that presentation must be preserved. My approach therefore is to present the material as a narrative (as it is published), with the vast majority voiced-over by a narrator character.
I have found it odd to see most people’s expectations of Silmarillion films are that it would take too many films to cover it all. In truth the available material is not that long. It would have been nice if J.R.R. Tolkien had been able to treat the entire construction with the same level of detail as The Lord of the Rings, but as it turned out, the condensed version we have was too much for him to fully complete in his lifetime. As stated before, I do not trust anyone other than Tolkien himself to write this detailed account, so I think it appropriate to present the whole construction in a condensed form as it was published. Maybe if some fine day we actually have Silmarillion movies, the stories with more detail available can be made into more expanded individual movies afterward.
I have gone to quite painstaking detail to estimate how long it would take to present The Silmarillion (as published) in film. As I stated, I think the best way to do this is to use the words from the book. The vast majority would be spoken by a narrator. There is a small amount of dialog attributed to specific characters. There is also much of the narrative that is descriptive and is made redundant by visuals. Taking all of this into account, I estimate the total runtime of film of the published Silmarillion to be 14 to 15 hours. I used the recorded book version to estimate the time it takes to speak the narrative in dramatic form.
It may not be a coincidence that I estimate the same material you are planning to cover in four films to also take four films. However, I also plan to make a film of the post-Quenta material. In fact, I plan for this to be the first film of the series. This is a total of five films of 2:40 to 2:50 each by the current estimate. I agree with what I’ve seen here than 3 hours is long for one movie, but at this time I prefer to stay with five films instead of breaking it into more, because the breaking points work out very well for five approximately equal pieces.
I think I read somewhere here about an idea to have a setting of Frodo at Rivendell being told the tales. I think this is a nice idea. What I have chosen to do draws from Tolkien’s aborted works The Lost Road and The Notion Club Papers. In these he creates a surrounding story in which the tales of the Legendarium are learned by one particular character from the ‘real’ world. His reason for this was his attempt to tie his mythology to England, but it also serves to mediate the material for the modern audience. The Hobbits of his best-known works serve this role there, being people that are not quite real but also much more like us than the grand characters of the Legendarium, and therefore put it in perspective, giving it its full power.
I have created a character based on J.R.R. Tolkien himself who travels to Eldamar and hears the tales. So, I have combined Tolkien’s ideas on moderating the Legendarium with a biographical tribute to the author himself. I am personally fond of this concept and find it appropriate.
The primary comment I have for you concerns your apparently cavalier attitude with regard to Tolkien’s work, which you don’t have rights to. What you create privately that is inspired by Tolkien is your business, but what you share publicly is not. I can assure you the Tolkien Estate is certainly against any public showing of any part of The Silmarillion, even if you don’t profit from it. I suggest that you not publish anything that is based on The Silmarillion unless you have explicit approval from the Tolkien Estate. If you ever succeed in your goal, you will find yourself in legal trouble. I think that if you want to continue with your project you need to keep it private and have no aspirations to share it publicly.
I share the same inspiration that you do. When I read The Silmarillion I wish to see it rendered in the same visual quality as Peter Jackson’s films. I decided to pursue this goal on my own, regardless of the status of the adaptation rights. The more I work on it the more convinced I am that it would work, but it’s an even greater risk than The Lord of the Rings films were. There’s more chance the broad audience will not relate to it. It would require even more resources and more individual films.
I think for a number of reasons The Silmarillion should be computer-animated. Not in a cartoon style, but using technology similar to how the settings and some characters like Gollum were created in Peter Jackson’s films. The number of characters in The Lord of the Rings is a drop in the bucket of the broader Legendarium. I envision use of the Massive software and techniques like those of The Polar Express where a small number of actors can perform all of the roles. I think if this project is primarily computer-generated it could be realized more efficiently. I could be wrong, but that’s the way I envision it. Also, the narrative moves quickly across broad spaces and time changes and the way I envision transitioning between scenes would have to be done by computer.
I’m posting here to give you some comments, but also to make you aware of a blog I’ve created where I make posts primarily regarding making a screenplay from The Silmarillion. I plan to post on anything and everything as I go. The address of my blog is noldothrond.luckydragonmahjong.com/blog/. I can’t make any commitment to participating in your forum, but you are welcome to make use of my ideas if you like them. I certainly welcome any comments or disagreements you might have.
My primary objective is to campaign for the Tolkien Estate to grant the adaptation rights to someone. I expect I don’t have the resources myself, and if I had my choice I would want Peter Jackson to serve that role. He has the resources both financially and the Weta Digital capacity for making such movies. Many people don’t like his films for various reasons, but I believe his primary goal was to be true to the work, and most every departure from that goal was a necessity of the realities of a commercial venture. Therefore I would trust him with The Silmarillion, though I would want the utmost in faithfulness to the Legendarium.
My goal with my blog is to make known the work I’m doing and draw attention to the feasibility of making Silmarillion films, and with these help to build momentum for the concept that even the Tolkien Estate could not avoid. As long as the rights are withheld by the Tolkien Estate I will keep the specifics of my work private, and if the rights are ever granted I would certainly like to be involved.
I will share here my opinions about what I’ve seen on this site and explain some of what I’m doing.
My first comment is about what material to cover. I personally do not trust anyone other than J.R.R. Tolkien himself to write compellingly about Middle-earth. I think a large part of the enjoyability of The Silmarillion is in how it is presented by the author, and for that reason that presentation must be preserved. My approach therefore is to present the material as a narrative (as it is published), with the vast majority voiced-over by a narrator character.
I have found it odd to see most people’s expectations of Silmarillion films are that it would take too many films to cover it all. In truth the available material is not that long. It would have been nice if J.R.R. Tolkien had been able to treat the entire construction with the same level of detail as The Lord of the Rings, but as it turned out, the condensed version we have was too much for him to fully complete in his lifetime. As stated before, I do not trust anyone other than Tolkien himself to write this detailed account, so I think it appropriate to present the whole construction in a condensed form as it was published. Maybe if some fine day we actually have Silmarillion movies, the stories with more detail available can be made into more expanded individual movies afterward.
I have gone to quite painstaking detail to estimate how long it would take to present The Silmarillion (as published) in film. As I stated, I think the best way to do this is to use the words from the book. The vast majority would be spoken by a narrator. There is a small amount of dialog attributed to specific characters. There is also much of the narrative that is descriptive and is made redundant by visuals. Taking all of this into account, I estimate the total runtime of film of the published Silmarillion to be 14 to 15 hours. I used the recorded book version to estimate the time it takes to speak the narrative in dramatic form.
It may not be a coincidence that I estimate the same material you are planning to cover in four films to also take four films. However, I also plan to make a film of the post-Quenta material. In fact, I plan for this to be the first film of the series. This is a total of five films of 2:40 to 2:50 each by the current estimate. I agree with what I’ve seen here than 3 hours is long for one movie, but at this time I prefer to stay with five films instead of breaking it into more, because the breaking points work out very well for five approximately equal pieces.
I think I read somewhere here about an idea to have a setting of Frodo at Rivendell being told the tales. I think this is a nice idea. What I have chosen to do draws from Tolkien’s aborted works The Lost Road and The Notion Club Papers. In these he creates a surrounding story in which the tales of the Legendarium are learned by one particular character from the ‘real’ world. His reason for this was his attempt to tie his mythology to England, but it also serves to mediate the material for the modern audience. The Hobbits of his best-known works serve this role there, being people that are not quite real but also much more like us than the grand characters of the Legendarium, and therefore put it in perspective, giving it its full power.
I have created a character based on J.R.R. Tolkien himself who travels to Eldamar and hears the tales. So, I have combined Tolkien’s ideas on moderating the Legendarium with a biographical tribute to the author himself. I am personally fond of this concept and find it appropriate.
The primary comment I have for you concerns your apparently cavalier attitude with regard to Tolkien’s work, which you don’t have rights to. What you create privately that is inspired by Tolkien is your business, but what you share publicly is not. I can assure you the Tolkien Estate is certainly against any public showing of any part of The Silmarillion, even if you don’t profit from it. I suggest that you not publish anything that is based on The Silmarillion unless you have explicit approval from the Tolkien Estate. If you ever succeed in your goal, you will find yourself in legal trouble. I think that if you want to continue with your project you need to keep it private and have no aspirations to share it publicly.
I share the same inspiration that you do. When I read The Silmarillion I wish to see it rendered in the same visual quality as Peter Jackson’s films. I decided to pursue this goal on my own, regardless of the status of the adaptation rights. The more I work on it the more convinced I am that it would work, but it’s an even greater risk than The Lord of the Rings films were. There’s more chance the broad audience will not relate to it. It would require even more resources and more individual films.
I think for a number of reasons The Silmarillion should be computer-animated. Not in a cartoon style, but using technology similar to how the settings and some characters like Gollum were created in Peter Jackson’s films. The number of characters in The Lord of the Rings is a drop in the bucket of the broader Legendarium. I envision use of the Massive software and techniques like those of The Polar Express where a small number of actors can perform all of the roles. I think if this project is primarily computer-generated it could be realized more efficiently. I could be wrong, but that’s the way I envision it. Also, the narrative moves quickly across broad spaces and time changes and the way I envision transitioning between scenes would have to be done by computer.
I’m posting here to give you some comments, but also to make you aware of a blog I’ve created where I make posts primarily regarding making a screenplay from The Silmarillion. I plan to post on anything and everything as I go. The address of my blog is noldothrond.luckydragonmahjong.com/blog/. I can’t make any commitment to participating in your forum, but you are welcome to make use of my ideas if you like them. I certainly welcome any comments or disagreements you might have.
My primary objective is to campaign for the Tolkien Estate to grant the adaptation rights to someone. I expect I don’t have the resources myself, and if I had my choice I would want Peter Jackson to serve that role. He has the resources both financially and the Weta Digital capacity for making such movies. Many people don’t like his films for various reasons, but I believe his primary goal was to be true to the work, and most every departure from that goal was a necessity of the realities of a commercial venture. Therefore I would trust him with The Silmarillion, though I would want the utmost in faithfulness to the Legendarium.
My goal with my blog is to make known the work I’m doing and draw attention to the feasibility of making Silmarillion films, and with these help to build momentum for the concept that even the Tolkien Estate could not avoid. As long as the rights are withheld by the Tolkien Estate I will keep the specifics of my work private, and if the rights are ever granted I would certainly like to be involved.